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lief erickson Said,
September 8th, 2009 @10:48 pm  

this is pretty rough. first where does growth come from in your economy. if there is no fractional reserve then there is no wealth being created, unless it is created by the government, through the treasury and such. if there was a 100% reserve it would be like there being only one bank and no aggregate loaning. like it or not thats how wealth is increased, through the increase in government spending. wealth does not come out of the ground. gold is only worth something because people accept it. the same is true with dollars. accept the money supply is endogenous and the public accepts the dollar for taxes. inflation only accrues when wages outpace productivity, which puts income pressure on output; not excess money because that assumes that the transaction demand is infinite.
next you are advocating for contracts on demand deposits. we already have those they are called CDs. forcing all individuals to lock their money up for a certain amount of time, or pay a fee for holding a checking account, is nuts. i believe that people of your ilk hate contracts and blame them for all rigidities in the economy. how would hayek explain contracts in his book prices and production. even more so to give banks even more power in a time of a banking crisis just seems off the deep end. this would send the banks in to competition with the interest rate bidding up the price of interest on savings which would drive up the interest on loans. creating more risky business investments as safe investments are saturated. above all where is the loanable funds market in today’s economy. savings rates are sky high and investment is nil and the interest rate is also. why are people saving now and not investing (people typically save by putting their money in the bank). above all banks would not want to loan to anyone except big business, they are the only guaranteed repayment. big business takes out a lot in debt with overdraft facilities regularly and repays on a level far in excess with the proportion going to consumers, the lower you are on income scale the more in debt you are.
continuing on your facts are misleading at best. unfunded liabilities doesn’t mean that they wont be funded an the number you post is so far in to the future as not to effect my grandchildren’s children. the way they work is our generation pays for the older generations and the same will be true in the future. me nor you nor anyone else will have to pay the sum you quote it will be paid over the 1000 years that the number represents. finally the national debt will be paid. what does one rotation around the sun have to do with paying down the debt.
there is so much more but i’m tired. i like what you are doing with your site, most of it is wrong however, you should have spent more time in the sociology department at the u of o

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Ryan Said,
September 9th, 2009 @11:04 am  

Thanks for the comment, Lief. This was a piece written by Andrew Syrios, and I’m sure he will respond to your thoughts. SwiftEconomics.com engages in editorials. Opinion pieces are exactly that, and I welcome different points of view from both writers and readers, in a robust debate. We do try to back up our opinions here with facts, and well-documented citations.

I’ll respond to a couple of your points. First, I like this article because it challenges people to think about the other extreme for a monetary system. This is a valuable exercise. Certainly, 100% reserve banking has its drawbacks, but if you think 100% reserve banking is absurd, realize that fiat money and 10% reserve banking is absurd as well. The power our monetary system gives to the Federal Reserve, a non-government entity, is simply astounding.

Your definition of wealth seems to be money. Makes sense, but I’d ask you to expand that definition in a moment. Your definition of economic growth seems to be all new money created in the economy, from the fractional reserve system or the Treasury printing press.

Money only represents wealth because it represents a medium of exchange for goods and services. The money supply does not grow without consequences. If money was wealth, and growth of the money supply had no consequences, why not print millions of dollars and hand them to every man, woman and child? Everybody would be wealthy. Of course, nobody would be wealthy (if their wealth was held in dollars) in this scenario. Unfortunately, this scenario is taking place, only on a smaller level. When the money supply is expanded, without respect to demand for goods and services in the economy, the dollar loses value. When the dollar loses its value, a person needs more dollars to buy the same amount of goods and services as before. This is called inflation.

You defined inflation as: “inflation only accrues when wages outpace productivity, which puts income pressure on output.” Actually, economists disagree on the cause of inflation. Some think there is demand-pull inflation, some cost-push inflation, some built-in inflation, and some believe increases in the money supply cause inflation. Check out this visual guide to inflation which clearly explains all four: http://www.swifteconomics.com/2009/08/04/a-visual-guide-to-inflation/

I tend to think all four can cause inflation, if inflation is simply a rise in price levels. Point being, money only represents wealth as far as its purchasing power to buy goods and services. There’s a reason households need two incomes to survive now. Household incomes are far greater today than they were in the 1960’s or ’70’s, so if money were wealth, the middle class should be rich. No, it’s just that it takes more money to purchase a lot of the same goods and services. Housing, food and energy alone account for much of these price increases. Most of our “wealth” increases, from a quality of life perspective, come from technology advances and the quasi-free market system delivering these advances to the masses (I hedge with quasi because our system is far from being free market). Take a kid from the ’60’s and place him/her in 2009 with an iPod, internet-browsing cell phone, laptop, HD TV with a million channels, dishwasher, washer/dryer, etc., and he/she would feel uber wealthy.

You believe that government spending is economic growth. Remember that government cannot create anything, they can only redirect. The money it spends is taxed, borrowed or printed. Debt spending could potentially spur long-run economic growth, if the money is invested in productive capacities, or areas that will create streams of income moving forward. How many income-producing assets does the government own? Given that we run deficits virtually every year, not too many. Amtrak is bankrupt, the Post Office is bankrupt, social security/medicare/medicaid is bankrupt. If the government took taxpayer money, and borrowed money from China, to start Google, then they’d have a valuable asset that creates long-run economic growth. The largest asset the government has is the ownership of revenue from taxpayers, and its ability to borrow money because of the value taxpayers and the American economy represent.

My definition of wealth is really quite simple: production. The U.S. economy runs on consumption of imported goods. When the Federal Reserve and Treasury pump new money into the economy, they are simultaneously creating debt liabilities. The debt is financed from abroad, often the same countries (China is the classic example) who sold us the consumer goods to begin with. Countries that have their debt under control, competitively produce and export goods to other nations, will have true long-run wealth.

The U.S. has extremely lackluster savings rates compared to other industrialized nations. I’m not sure why it is you think people are hoarding tons of money. Savings rates have increased to 5% of personal disposable income during the recession, but Americans still spend almost every dollar they earn.

Obviously, the entire public debt and/or unfunded liabilities will not come due tomorrow. Everyone knows that. However, some people resent the fact that our grandchildren’s children’s children will still be paying off debt spending and obligations from our, and previous, generation(s). In fact, some people would call born indebtedness immoral. Despite the fact repayment on these debts and obligations will take a long, long time (and what makes anyone think a government of any political stripe will stop spending, thus increasing the debt?), the existence of the debt does effect us now. I’ll give you one example. The 10-year Treasury rate drives mortgage rates and other lines of credit. Once the Federal Reserve stops buying our own Treasury debt, and mortgage-backed securities, mortgage rates will increase in a meaningful way. This will cause more foreclosures and make it difficult for the housing market to stabilize. Higher mortgage rates will make it more expensive for anyone to own, and pay debt service, on a home. There are consequences for increasing the money supply and mass accumulating debt.

Thanks for reading our content and offering your opinion.

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Andrew Said,
September 9th, 2009 @12:04 pm  

I think you cover most of what I would say Ryan. I am curious as to why you think I hate contracts Leif? I didn’t see the connection there. Plus I was referring to the need to pay to keep your money at the bank as a downside to the system of 100% reserve banking.

I’ll make a few other points:

1) The idea that inflation and unemployment of growth are inversely connected should have ended with stagflation in the 1970’s. As Milton Friedman noted, inflation preceded drops in unemployment. Thus, in all likelihood, inflation caused firms to think they were more profitable than they were, so they hired more, then they wised up and boom; stagflation.

2) I know that gold, like fiat money, simply represents the wealth of the economy. But then it stands that an increase in the money supply with out a corresponding increase in output will mean that each dollar represents less wealth than before, i.e. inflation.

3) There is no reason to believe that growth is only due to government spending or fractional reserve banking. After all, investment can only come from savings. Fractional reserve banking just makes a bunch more paper money, not real savings. So one would expect the increased paper money to simply make the rest of the paper money represent less wealth (inflation). The advantage here is that without inflation, there is a disincentive to invest, but the savings available to invest is unchanged.

4) One of the things I was trying to emphasize is that by artificially lowering interest rates and increasing the credit available (through the Fed and fractional reserve banking) we stimulate debt over savings. The idea was to encourage capital accumulation over debt financing. There are up and downsides to both, but given how many people are up to their eyeballs in debt, I’ll go with savings. Given Wal-Street’s propensity to bundle loans to reduce risk, I see no reason that only big business would have access to credit under this system.

5) We had an enormous amount of malinvestment in real estate, the economy is still reeling. Thus, people and firms are trying to shore up their savings while liquidating bad assets. It will take some time before these savings will turn into actual investments, although the government has decided to invest much of their money for them by using debt and money creation.

6) I do not mention unfunded liabilities in this article, but I have in other places. Unfunded liabilities by themselves, admittedly, is a bit of a scare number. The problem is when you compare them to expected tax receipts. Now long term estimates are highly speculative, but it does appear, especially from David Walker’s analysis, that the United States is headed for fiscal insolvency.

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August 24th, 2009 @2:28 pm  

[...] we had a banking system that required more than a 10% reserve ratio, bank runs wouldn’t be so scary. The first question I always consider whenever the government [...]

February 28th, 2010 @12:21 pm  

[...] The second phase of the Bernanke plan involves selling banks what essentially would be a certificate of deposit. The bank would give the Fed a chunk of its reserves, while the Fed would pay the bank interest. Banks would not be able to count their investment in the Fed as cash or reserves, slowing the process of fractional reserve banking. [...]

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